Workplace Effectiveness

Interview with Dr. Tim EwingTim is a global diversity and organizational development leader with an expertise in workplace effectiveness. He has consulted to global and US-based organizations as the founder and president of BreakThrough Dynamics International, LLC.

MONIQUE BETTY: Welcome to Looking Glass Academy. This is executive career coach Monique Betty, and I am delighted to have our guest, Dr. Tim Ewing, with us today. Hello. How are you, Dr. Ewing?

TIM EWING: I’m doing well, Monique. Good to hear your voice.

MONIQUE: Oh, it’s a pleasure to have you with us today. In our three-part series this month, Dr. Ewing is going to speak to workplace effectiveness and the diverse leader. And before we begin with questions, Dr. Ewing, is it okay if I acknowledge you as Tim?

TIM: Yes, that would be fine, thank you.

MONIQUE: Oh, great. And for our audience, Tim is a global diversity and organizational development leader with an expertise in workplace effectiveness. Tim and his firm, BreakThrough Dynamics International, have consulted to global and US-based organizations for close to 20 years. So if I must say so myself, a true subject matter expert.

And recognizing that at CareerSYNC we have many individuals of a diverse population who are pretty much mid career and working in various sizes of organizations and many in large organizations, this topic is really of utmost importance because oftentimes, it just is one of those things that we kind of know is playing in the background. Diversity is important and that organizations are committed to diversity. But I’m hoping that today the audience will be able to take away how this relates to them as leaders in their respective organizations.

So let’s begin Part 1 – would you please define diversity for us? How do you approach that term and its meaning with your clients?

TIM: So diversity, I think is very expansive and I think each organizational system oftentimes defines it for themselves. So the basic definition that I hold is unique characteristics that define us as individuals. And that can range from one socialized entity to their tenure in an organization to, you know, things that are of value to them.

I think what makes it unique to individuals or organizations are those differences that make a difference to the organization as well. So as we know, in many cases, you know, gender and racial, ethnic minorities within organizations are oftentimes labeled as the diverse candidates.

But we hold it in the larger sense and say that all are diverse and given the history in the United States these groups, you know, people of color, disenfranchised groups historically are the groups that we need to actually formulate programs to certainly highlight what we bring to organizations, while simultaneously with our light counterparts, teaching skills to certainly acknowledge what some of those differences are.


TIM: And also, you know, having opportunities, I’m sorry, go ahead.

MONIQUE: No. I was going to say, absolutely. And I love that, you know, how you’ve kind of couched diversity as everyone in their own uniqueness is of a diverse entity, so to speak.

TIM: Absolutely.

MONIQUE: And I think it limits us into thinking that diversity is only defined by race and gender. Is that fair?

TIM: Yes, that’s absolutely fair. And in fact, I think in most cases, diversity has become code for race and gender.

MONIQUE: Yes, exactly. What have you seen to be some of the major shifts in the past decade with regard to diversity initiatives?

TIM: I will certainly say that some of the shifts had been around how we even think about diversity and inclusion. So I think early on, it was around awareness building. And once the awareness sessions happened or those workshops happened, people took that binder, put it on their shelves and went back to business as usual.

At present, what I’m seeing is not only are people going through awareness building but also introspection around what are some of the biases that I hold that actually limit me from seeing others’ full potential or even tapping into my own full potential because of some of the organizational dynamics that play out.

MONIQUE: Oh, I mean that must be a little touchy though when you’re thinking in a, you know, make people a little uncomfortable.

TIM: Absolutely. You know, this work is not just to check off the box. It’s about really understanding what we bring to the table and how…

MONIQUE: And how do you get underneath that with the biases? I mean, is that an assessment-based tool?

TIM: I think there are certainly tools out there and instruments to assess those. But I think the real learning comes in relationship. And actually, at BreakThrough Dynamics, that’s what we actually look at in terms of the underpinning of both individual and organizational change. The relationships become the incubator, if you will, for learning across differences.

So I’ll give you an example. Working around biases and really understanding our own personal journey, we may find that if we are working in those places, we may have more commonality with people than we actually realize, right?

MONIQUE: Mm-hmm.

TIM: And also that there are values that come out of our personal experience that shape how we view individuals or members of diverse groups. So how then do we take those two components and build relationships across them?

MONIQUE: Because, you know, you can’t fault someone for what their journey has been. If they’ve never been around individuals of a diverse population, then all of a sudden you get in the workplace and you’re coming in with a preconceived set of ideas about what these…

TIM: Absolutely.

MONIQUE: …you know, this other group of people means. And you’re applying meaning to it and drawing conclusions from it. So tapping into that individual biases I think is essential. So, terrific.

TIM: Absolutely. And then I think the next piece, Monique, becomes not only tapping into what the biases are but how does that manifest in terms of one’s behavior to make a critical piece.

MONIQUE: Mm-hmm. Does anything come to top of mind of maybe any ah-ha’s that a client you’ve worked with has experienced in terms of what their biases have manifested for them?

TIM: Absolutely. I think that in many ways when, there are several pieces. When you actually look at the organizational data, and some of the analytics that show where there are bottlenecks, if you will, or people not migrating to senior level positions for various reasons. So that’s the hard core data to see that, for example, there may be a school that has a preference in terms of mobility with an organization. There may be individuals who are expressive in terms of being extroverted than introverted. And you see that as archetype of leadership.

And then you look at some of the gender or racial, ethnic data and how does that manifest within the organizations looking at those pieces. So there is that piece. And then a new adventure that we, adventure I say and I use that term very carefully, because another component of this is actually having talent review sessions where we can actually give feedback to some of the managers around how they’re even describing the behaviors of people of color, of women, of…


TIM: …some of those emerging talents, yes, as well.

MONIQUE: And that takes place in a talent review session. How do individuals kind of respond to those review sessions?

TIM: Well, of course, there has to be a lot of trust.

MONIQUE: Right, exactly.

TIM: Exactly. So there has to be trust and there has to be a readiness and a willingness. And I say that coaching that team about what our functions will be within those settings are going to be important, as well as I have a colleague who worked with a major client in Ohio, for example. And really the candor of the consultant and the willingness to be relational and not to shame but to actually challenge carefully around being able to highlight what some of the patterns are.

How are we talking about expressive African-American men and women in comparison to our Euro-American or white colleagues within the organization? How are we talking about how those of Asian descent are showing up in meetings and demonstrating leadership? And the other learning piece becomes, how does that leader expand their bandwidth of what leadership actually looks like, right? And so that’s the learning that’s happening at their organizational level.

MONIQUE: Well, you know, when you think about an organization and/or its leaderships, its readiness, its willingness, I would imagine that that may be motivated by or driven by the critical mission of this work. How does it affect the bottom line? Do you have quantifiable measures that you can point to in kind of making that case, that managing diverse, diversity is mission-critical for an organization?

TIM: Yes. Yes, we do. In that, so all of the work that we do is first and foremost, we do research, so within the organization and about the organization and the industry. And looking at where, for example, it is a retail organization and where is the buying power of the various populations, how is it manifesting within those different markets, who is actually representing the organization in those markets, how are we building relationships within those communities to actually get real-time data that actually support what’s going on in those markets.

In addition, I have not run into a single organization that is not being asked to do more with fewer people. And those leaders, for example, are constantly tapping into the same talent. And there’s a whole cadre of untapped talent that exist in the organization that’s not being actualized, it’s not being effectively managed, as well as there are opportunities that are being lost. I think…

MONIQUE: And, yes, and that…

TIM: Yeah.

MONIQUE: …that really resonates with people when you talk about what you’re leaving on the table or what opportunities are being lost as a result of…

TIM: Exactly.

MONIQUE: …not elevating the work around diversity, I would imagine.

TIM: Yes. And I think the other part that’s often humorous is, humorous and sad to some degree, I would say that. But, you know, when we say that the organizational culture isn’t conducive to “diversity,” well, the organization is actually made up of individuals. So it’s about the individual change that changes the culture of the organization.

MONIQUE: Exactly.

TIM: And this is the politics and process…

MONIQUE: I like that. Yeah.

TIM: Yeah.

MONIQUE: Yeah. An organization is only made up of individuals. That’s so true.

TIM: Absolutely, absolutely.

MONIQUE: One final question here as we bring Part 1 of our three-part series to a close is that, you know, let’s turn the tables a little bit and talk about legislation. To what degree has either Federal and/or state legislation impacted organizations to embrace strategies for diversity and organizational development? Is there anything that’s evolving or occurring that we should be made aware of?

TIM: Sure, absolutely. I think that we can just look at, for example, diversity in regards to those being gay, bisexual, and transgender professionals in the workplace. That’s certainly another arena that we’re starting to see significant change. For example, that 40 states now have, you know, marriage equality and we’re still, you know, waiting for the 10 remaining states and five US territories.

MONIQUE: Right, and then that resonates with the benefits as well.

TIM: Absolutely, absolutely. So we’ll see a ripple effect there. I think the immigration law are certainly going to impact who’s showing up in the workplace and then who are we marketing to in the workplace, in the market, excuse me, and the external work support. And how that certainly will impact diversity and inclusion within organizations.

I even would venture to say, I know that on the tail end of, we’re in the midst of the Ferguson, Missouri case that’s, you know, certainly been forefront for many of us, even law enforcement are coming together to revisit how they approach and how they engage with African-American males as well as Latino male. And I think really braving that to a level of consciousness will shift perhaps how the media portrays men of color.

And therefore, shifting that, you know, and there’s a complexity here around both acknowledging that we’re a member of a group as African-American men and Latino men, for example, and that we’re also individuals with individual characteristics and the complexity of that.

MONIQUE: Right, absolutely. And so you think, on the horizon, I just think the country will have no choice, is to think harder and smarter about legislation to support the kind of America that we want our citizens to enjoy.

TIM: Absolutely. And that the founding fathers, the opportunities for us that the founding creators of this country certainly intended, in my opinion.

MONIQUE: So Tim, if I could just start off by asking you, what are some of the greatest barriers to an organization’s ability to leverage diversity?

TIM: I think it’s multifaceted. Primarily I think initially, it’s around some of the blind spots that an organization culture has in terms of being able to see the value of diversity within their organization. I think many organizational systems assume that, I think there’s a great book called What Got You Here Won’t Get You There. So many of the leaders feel as if what got them to their position of leadership and what got the organization into their current position is what will get them, move them into the future. And I’m here to tell you that the landscape has certainly changed and those things won’t apply any longer.

MONIQUE: Well, and exactly. And as you mentioned in last week’s, in our interview last week, you know, just from the quantifiable perspective, there may be opportunity being left on the table. And in particular for organizations with shareholders, it’s their responsibility to ensure that they are leveraging the full scope of their resources.

TIM: Precisely. And I also agree that, you know, if we look at the experiences of diverse talent within organizations, that people are having enriching, engaging experiences within the organization, then they’re more likely to share that information with their formal and informal networks. So I think which then also create opportunities for the business to create partnerships and also to do additional business as well. So the internal experience impacts the external outcome also.

MONIQUE: That’s a terrific point. I hadn’t really thought about that. But you almost, in a way, your current employee base kind of becomes your ambassadors and may be a good channel to other top talent who would desire…

TIM: Yes.

MONIQUE: …to work there because it’s a desirable workplace.

TIM: It’s a desirable workplace. And if I feel valued, then I want those that I know to also come and join our organization because they too will experience this positive experience that I’m having.

So a key is that if people are not happy, you know, and in the organizational development arena, we often say, people don’t quit their job, they quit their bosses.


TIM: So that leader or that manager or that supervisor is not culturally competent and sees, and they’re having diversity and inclusion competencies as a leadership ability, then I think there’s a loss of talent and a loss of business consequently.

MONIQUE: I love that term, culturally competent, which really kind of takes me to my question, in terms of what are the key steps in creating a culture to really discuss and brace these differences that are posed by the diversity advancement?

TIM: Wow. That’s, you know, that’s often the challenge. And I think understanding the culture and what the culture has espoused and what they value is certainly addressed in that arena.

I think another place is really to look at those relationships. I’ve come back to that multiple times and I think of relationships on multiple fronts. Because if my supervisor knows who I am then I have mentors within the organization who can help me to navigate through the organization. I think that’s another way of doing that.

And also, sponsorship at the individual level. Making sure that there’s someone in that space who’s willing to advocate on my behalf.

But in order to have mentors or sponsors or even a manager who can relate to me, I have to be willing to show up more fully. And let me tell you what I mean by that. Inherently, in some of us and some people of color, we have a distrust of system. And I think if we can allow ourselves to test the boundary of the organization to say, how much and how far can I show up and being able to test the waters around that?


TIM: Simultaneously, I feel that our white colleague mission-vision have to be able to expand their bandwidth to meet professionals of color on their turf. And what I mean by that is being able to reach out and experience what I as an African-American, for example, what my life is like and look at the ways in which actually there may be similarity. And the differences are uniquenesses in terms of negatives, right?


TIM: So I think there are two ways in which we’re co-creating this new dynamic that exists. Also, so that’s at the individual and the personal level.


TIM: I think the organization has to certainly create avenue for conversations to happen.

MONIQUE: And how do they go about doing that? Right. How do they go about creating those avenues? Are those like the affinity groups or giving group meet and connect?

TIM: Yes, affinity groups is certainly one way to do that. And having a group where people can have opportunities to dialog about the organization, about their individual experience and how that certainly impacts the organization.

One of the things that I think has been really effective has been creating diversity partners within the organization. That’s to say, leaders who can come together to talk about their own diversity and also how they may be influencing, their decisions may be influencing the organization.

I think something else that happens, Monique, is for professionals of color becoming skillful at articulating where it is we want to go and how we want to get there and getting feedback from those leaders and managers in terms of how to navigate those systems to get the skills that we need.

MONIQUE: Exactly. That’s a constant part of conversation I often have with clients. It’s that are you articulating where it is that you want to go and…

TIM: Right.

MONIQUE: …solicit support in getting there.

TIM: Yes. Because how can a manager know what we want if we haven’t certainly articulated those parts, those aspirations.

MONIQUE: Absolutely, absolutely. And often times, I know from my experience in corporate and what I often hear from clients, if you are a minority working in a majority organization of majority whites, that often times there’s a feeling of isolation and feeling kind of alone or be in your own little place because others don’t understand.

And to the word you used, I don’t’ think, often times when, you know, leaders have done a good job in co-creating a situation, they haven’t made others kind of feel welcomed to open up dialogs so that any else can offer assistance. So there is the responsibility on every individual’s part.

TIM: I was working within an organization. I have to tell you the story. And, you know, we talked about building relationships. And this really sharp young African-American male said, “You know, I have relationship with both leaders. They know who I am. They greet me by name as we’re working through the organization. So what more is needed? Do I need to invite them to my house for barbeque?” I mean, you know…


TIM: “Do I need to ask them, do they want to walk my dog?” I mean he says, “What more do I need to do, you know?” And I think that he really lends himself to being intentional about what does a strategic career stewardship oriented conversation looks like and really gaining some skills and nuances around that.

MONIQUE: Yeah. I guess a response to that question, I would say, “Yeah, it could be, come on over for a barbeque or come help walk my dog.”

TIM: Exactly.

MONIQUE: Oh my god. If it would help to take your relationship to a different level, you know, maybe.

TIM: Absolutely, absolutely.

MONIQUE: Meet me at the dog park. It would take down some of the, you know, fabricated walls that individuals have in their minds when they’re inside of the workplace.

TIM: Sure.

MONIQUE: Just allow room for expanding on the possibilities of a relationship. So don’t rule it out.

TIM: Yeah, don’t rule out is right. Don’t rule out is right.

MONIQUE: And did you have any final points? So we’re going to go ahead and draw our second of our three-part series to a close. So I think you’ve offered some real terrific insights.

TIM: So I think the biggest points where I want to close on is the point of grace, and when I say grace, this is what I mean. That in having relationships across difference, there are going to be mishaps, misunderstanding and missteps that happen.


TIM: And having the grace I think to be able to manage those in a healthy way, there can still be relationship building. I think that’s really important.

MONIQUE: And what I think I hear you saying is instead of just getting instantly on the dissents.

TIM: Yes.

MONIQUE: And making assumptions about someone’s intention as opposed to it was a misstep.

TIM: It was a misstep.

MONIQUE: That maybe having the dialog to help one understand how maybe there is another way that that could be viewed what was just said.

TIM: Precisely. Exactly.

MONIQUE: And so that’s how you create, co-create that space.

TIM: Yes. And then I think that’s how organizations shift. So we have the educational components, the individual component. And then looking at the practices and procedures and policies that actually encourage and support inclusion, I think that’s how organizations change.

MONIQUE: The policies and the practices.

TIM: Yes.

MONIQUE: And, you know, one of the points mentioned coming out of, you know, last week’s session around, you know, some of the same-sex marriage policies, that are being embraced by, you know, the states across the country is opening the door to redefining even how our benefits, how our policies and practices are being shaped. And so I think that’s terrific that that’s actually because of the vast range of diversity in our country which makes America so great, you know, policy is having to catch up with that.

TIM: Right. Exactly.

MONIQUE: As opposed to having the other way around because of policy, then people would behave. It’s like, no, people are living their American dream. And the policies have to get in shape behind that.

TIM: That’s a great example. Great example.

MONIQUE:, When you think of diverse leaders, what are some of the unwritten rules for advancement and success for minority leaders that, you know, really may not fairly exist for, let’s say, their white counterparts?

TIM: Well, there definitely are rules that certainly exist. And I think, as I touched on upon in our last session, having mentors and sponsors that certainly help to navigate through those myriad of dynamics within organizations really becomes, you know, a touchdown in terms of what are some of the written rules and unwritten rules that may not be as obvious but, yes, make a difference in terms of how minority leaders or professionals of color move throughout the organization and particularly move throughout the hierarchy of the organization as well.

Another aspect, and I’m going to rely on a colleague of mine, Dani Monroe, who’s written a book called Untapped Talent. And in her book, Untapped Talent, it refers to three aspects that we, as professionals of color, bring to our work. And it’s resourcefulness, resilience, and resolve. And a part of tapping into those three Rs of leadership is understanding our personal journeys and our personal stories and really seeing the strengths that materialize through our story.

For example, I think about myself. On my dad’s side of my family, I have at least 28-plus first cousins and on my mom’s side of the family…

MONIQUE: Oh, wow.

TIM: Yeah, that’s a lot, right?


TIM: And then on my mom’s side of the family, I’m one of 12. I have, you know, some 30 first cousins. And therefore, I always grew up as a part of a group. And I knew that my identity was group-oriented. Well, isn’t that something that organizations look for today in terms of knowing how to navigate through groups, knowing how to speak up in a group, knowing how to pay attention to group dynamic. That was also another part of growing up in a large family structure.


TIM: And therefore, that becomes a resource for me in terms of my organizational experience to realize that some of the barriers that we’ve had or some of the obstacles that we’ve had, that we’ve overcome had actually taught us lessons that help us survive within our organization and seeing that as a source of resilience. And then the resolve that comes with, “Hey, I have overcome those components,” and how I leverage those aspects with who I am to certainly be successful within my organizational life.

MONIQUE: Mm-hmm. I think that is terrific. And you said, what was her, your colleague’s name that you referenced the Untapped Talent?

TIM: Sure. Her name is Dani Monroe, D-A-N-I Monroe, M-O-N-R-O-E. And I tell you that even, and I love that she came up with the language to actually describe what those aspects of strength and leadership that we bring. Because although our organization may not tap into those aspects of who we are at a cultural level, at the individual level, that’s what I believe helps us to be successful within our organizational life.

MONIQUE: Mm-hmm. And I think that’s interesting because that can also be parlayed on how our journey has allowed each of us to be even successful in whatever endeavors in the workplace or outside that we choose to pursue. So I think that that’s a terrific kind of way of framing how one’s experience helps to shape their own, you know, intentions around their advancement and success in the workplace.

TIM: Absolutely. Yes, yes, yes. And these are rich stories in terms of caring about, or being aware of your family’s migration. I think about my own grandparents and their migration from the south to the north and why were they migrating. And then how does that migration story impact my journey now because, you know, within my family, I was the first to pursue a PhD and doing that trailblazing that my grandparents had done in terms of their journeys. And what can I learn from the family narrative about how to navigate the systems that I operate in.


TIM: I’m also the first in my family to become an organizational development consultant and finding out how do I align in the organization in the way that honors who I am, my story, and allows me to be successful in those contexts.

MONIQUE: Mm-hmm. You know, and so along that line or along that thinking of, you know, an individual’s journey stories, is that kind of what serves as the foundation of cultures, organizational cultures? Because if, in fact, the organization is made up of one particular group or another, kind of takes on that identity of those individuals.

TIM: Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. Many of the organizations that we operate in, they were started by someone’s story, right?

MONIQUE: Mm-hmm.

TIM: Someone’s experience of starting this organization because of X, starting this organization because of Y. I think of one of my clients that’s a cosmetic company was about empowering woman. And if you don’t understand that story of those leaders, then how can you resonate with that story and then tap into your own story that’s compatible or that actually helps you to strive within that system?

MONIQUE: Right, exactly. And when you think about the journey for women, I mean, I still think there’s so much to be seen in terms of the leadership roles that women are taking on because you have a baby boomer generation poised for, you know, the top seats at this time who came up in an era where maybe it wasn’t even appropriate for a woman to think that she should be a wage-earner or make lots of money or be a big decision-maker.

TIM: Likely, yes.

MONIQUE: You know, and so that’s, you know, a shift in having to not only bring an organization and its ideas along, but as you referenced your family’s journey, they’re having to bring their families along as well…

TIM: Absolutely.

MONIQUE: …to see what they’re doing is foreign to them.

TIM: Yes, yes. And I think as we share our story, we’ll find that there are others who may have similar journeys. They can relate to our, well, to help eliminate some of the isolation, to know that someone else who across difference, whatever that difference may be, may also be having a parallel journey.

And what I’ve noticed in my work, because, you know, the Civil Rights Movement or the (attitude) [0:08:26] before really is still very new if you think about the development of the nation.

MONIQUE: Right, very young.

TIM: Yeah, we’re still seeing many professionals of color who are first time, first generation working in corporate America, first time, first generation going off to college. So there’s a lot that we may carry in terms of responsibility, in terms of realizing, you know, at some level because the organizational cultures have not shifted that I as an African-American, for example, represent to the organization other African-Americans. So being very mindful of that.

Simultaneously, I feel as if my work is to support the organization in realizing the complexity of yes, you may have African-American male employees or Latino male employees or Latina or Asian women, but there are also individuals who represent individual cultures and have individual strengths.

So really expanding the organization’s capacity for complexity of who we are as people of color.

MONIQUE: And, you know, this really resonates with me what you’re saying. And as I think about often times it’s, and I’m speaking on behalf of women, I’ve heard it being said, “Well, it’s hard to build relationships within the workplace. They have a way of connecting out on the golf course and what have you. Because sometimes you need to take the conversation our of the, you know, the brick and mortar of the organization and be in maybe more social environment to kind of bring down the walls and allow for rich conversations.

Well this as you have shared, it gives kind of a, this is something to talk about. This is something that when given time and space, sharing your own personal journey, your family’s story helps to eliminate or minimize the differences between us. And when you’re getting out of the rush, rush, rush of the 9 to 5.

TIM: Yes.

MONIQUE: I mean, 9 to 5 is just such a misnomer.

But when you can find opportunities outside of the workplace to connect with your colleagues and share this type of stories, that’s then where the rich a-has come in terms of meaningful relationships. It helps minimize that, “Boy, we’re more similar, you know, than we are different.” Once we can beyond as just being an individual representative of a gender, group of sexuality or race group or what have you.

TIM: Yes. And I would offer as well, Monique, that, you know, making sure that it’s a mutual exchange because, you know, we want to have safety, right? So usually, if I am sharing about myself, you know, having inquiries to share, ask others about themselves so that it’s actually an exchange. It’s conversational.

MONIQUE: Exactly, exactly. It is a conversation. It’s a two-way street.

TIM: Absolutely. And so realize that there is, there may be some degree of vulnerability on both parts to actually have that relationship become more meaningful.

MONIQUE: Terrific point, terrific point. And Tim, let me ask you, you know, what does the future hold for the advancement of diversity and organizational effectiveness? What are you seeing out there that individuals should be made aware of?

TIM: Well, for the most part, I think it’s catching a very simple phrase which is change or die.

MONIQUE: Great. Exactly. Yes.

TIM: Either organizations respond to the diversity of their workforce, their internal workforce and creating organizational spaces where people can thrive, where every single employee who crosses the threshold into that organization has the opportunity to thrive. And then that therefore manifests in terms of the deliverables in the external marketplace. For me, it’s very, very simple. The challenge becomes, the challenge becomes first seeing the necessity to changing behavior. And three, actually walking, organizations walking their talk in terms of saying they want it, but be willing to change to get it so that they can meet their organizational objective.

MONIQUE: Well, and I love that quote, to change or die. In fact, even as we speak, the numbers are slowly shifting. We’ve, you know, I think used the term majority to refer to our Anglo brethren. But let me tell you, the majority are soon going to be people of color.

TIM: Precisely, yes. Yes, yes. And so how do we acknowledge the uniquenesses that people are bringing to the workplace?

MONIQUE: To achieve the results of delivering in the marketplace.

TIM: Yes.

MONIQUE: At the end of it. And making sure that you’re not leaving anything on the table, but instead embracing and expanding that which is in your resource we all have.

TIM: Yeah.

MONIQUE: Instead of stifling it, allow it to grow and flourish. So I love that. Well, do you have any closing points, Tim? I really appreciate your time here with as today in Looking Glass Academy.

TIM: Yes. I lend myself to really think about the co-creation of organizations and how, you know, it’s a collective effort. And the more we risk to show up and organizations are ready to hear what we have to say, I think there are greater opportunities for collaboration, creativity and innovation.

And so to me, those are words that energize me.

MONIQUE: Absolutely.

TIM: The words that inspire me to wake up to want to go to work because of the innovative opportunities and to realize there are also going to be rubs along the way. But the organization has a context where some of the bumps in the road across differences can actually be learning opportunities for growth and development.

MONIQUE: Absolutely, absolutely. And that’s kind of the journey in life, isn’t it?

TIM: Isn’t it?

MONIQUE: To learn from bumps in the road. That is for certain. Well, Dr. Tim Ewing, thank you so much for being with us today. I’d like to invite our listeners, if you like to kind of follow Tim in the social media sphere, that you can find him on LinkedIn and we look forward to you and for me, your social media audience of when you’re going to have a new website available for individuals to as well continue to follow the good work that you’re doing with BreakThrough Dynamics.

So it’s been a pleasure. Thank you so much. Taking much away from this conversation in terms of workplace effectiveness and the diverse leader. And appreciate all of you for being with us today. Thank you much, Tim. I really appreciate it.

TIM: And thank you, Monique. This has been a real opportunity.

MONIQUE: Terrific. Have a great day. Success to all.